ASRA and other event organisers
I would like to clarify a few things regarding ASRA's position on events and event organisers.
ASRA encourages and welcomes any new Downhill events on the calender and any expansion of the racing scene as we have done unreservedly for many years now. In this regard we welcome GSE's efforts in organising two new races.
What we take issue with:
A private company has offered a set of services on our website directly to our members that duplicate what we already offer. Without talking to ASRA about this, it seems a strange approach to take and a big waste of our resources.
Without any consultation with ASRA, GSE has declared a national series along with a National Championships and a national ranking system to be run by a private company. It is not the place of a private company to unilaterally declare the National championships of a sport nor run a national ranking system and invite the national body to participate in their private venture.
Regarding rankings and national champions:
Why do national bodies do this? Because they have the skills to do this, they are generally independent of race organisers, they have a democratic structure, and their interests are broadly aligned with their members. National bodies are also the only organisations that can gain legitimate government recognition for national sports.
With regard to IGSA points:
ASRA is an affiliate body of the IGSA in Australia. Our President, Haggy Strom, is the Australian Director of the IGSA. The IGSA interacts with the Australian scene through ASRA, not through private event organisers.
There are appropriate ways of doing this and GSE's approach is not one of them. We would be happy to have GSE consult with us privately about this rather than communicate to individual members of ASRA through our website.
ASRA encourages and welcomes any new Downhill events on the calender and any expansion of the racing scene as we have done unreservedly for many years now. In this regard we welcome GSE's efforts in organising two new races.
What we take issue with:
A private company has offered a set of services on our website directly to our members that duplicate what we already offer. Without talking to ASRA about this, it seems a strange approach to take and a big waste of our resources.
Without any consultation with ASRA, GSE has declared a national series along with a National Championships and a national ranking system to be run by a private company. It is not the place of a private company to unilaterally declare the National championships of a sport nor run a national ranking system and invite the national body to participate in their private venture.
Regarding rankings and national champions:
Why do national bodies do this? Because they have the skills to do this, they are generally independent of race organisers, they have a democratic structure, and their interests are broadly aligned with their members. National bodies are also the only organisations that can gain legitimate government recognition for national sports.
With regard to IGSA points:
ASRA is an affiliate body of the IGSA in Australia. Our President, Haggy Strom, is the Australian Director of the IGSA. The IGSA interacts with the Australian scene through ASRA, not through private event organisers.
There are appropriate ways of doing this and GSE's approach is not one of them. We would be happy to have GSE consult with us privately about this rather than communicate to individual members of ASRA through our website.
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Replies to This Discussion
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ASRA AdminPermalink Reply by Bugs on -
ASRA is required to maintain financial records, and to provide them to our members at the Annual General Meeting, and to submit those financial records to the NSW Government. We do all this.
We are also required to give our members two weeks notice of our AGM. We do this.
We have never had a big turn up to our AGM. I wish it were different - I wish more people would come. If you're interested in seeing how ASRA works from the inside I encourage you to get involved.
None of the ASRA Committee are paid by ASRA - we are all strictly volunteers. ASRA isn't getting rivers of money from anybody - it's more like a trickle from sponsorship, member's fees, and race fees. That money gets spent on the website, our insurance policy, and the general expenses of putting on races. We've been pretty tight with spending money - we have a healthy sum in the ASRA bank account. We want this organisation to last and not fritter itself away.
Compare this to if we were a company instead of a democratic association registered with the NSW Government. A company, even a "non-profit" company, does not have to report to anybody but their shareholders. The directors of the company can pay themselves massive wages and not declare a profit, so the term "non-profit" is meaningless.
To complain that ASRA is not open with information is getting things backwards - we'll always be more open than a private company. -
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Permalink Reply by Robbo on
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Carl
We have about 197 members of ASRA
we have about 1650 people who have signed up for our website
We have about 40,000 people who visit our website on a monthly basis
We have 5 guys who work for ASRA tirelessly for no monetary reward and have done for many years now. I doubt there is anybody in this country that has put more time into the community than us. This has cost us (not ASRA) personally and financially a great sum.
I'm not sure there is an association more open than ASRA. We fulfill all our legal requirements as a registered sporting association We communicate with our members on a daily basis and immerse and involve ourselves in our community more than anybody else. I haven't had a holiday in 3 years, all I do is work on ASRA which has cost me a fortune and has ruined my relationships
We also let people throw rocks at us, insult us and accuse us of corruption on our own website in a public way, yet we still respond so our entire community and the broader public can see. Ask yourself what sporting association in this country opens themselves to that much personal scrutiny? What registered association gives their members and anybody who wants to have a crack a public space on our website to slander us and put questions over our integrity. We are not the 'Big Banks', we don't get paid for this, we absorb that for nothing.
It would be fantastic if people would let us get back to the job of putting on the IGSA World Cup which is in 2 weeks. Believe me it is an enormous job putting on a professional event of this size and having to respond to insults and accusations from people right now is very taxing when we are trying to put all our waking moments into running the biggest World Cup event of the year -
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Premium MemberPermalink Reply by Lance and Josh on -
if one draws its comparisons from motor racing , there is always a "sporting " body ; one who acts on (usually) a world governing bodies behalf...in our case it ASRA
then there needs (and should be) a host of commercial body(s) to organise events for reward . thats the way it works best simple and irrefutable .but for GSE to think it can run a national points and grading system......thats a bit of boundary jumping not needed and just shows inexperience on behalf of the directors .
maybe on the converse after GSE prove their ability etc they should put there hat in the ring and compete to be the promoter of Newtons , while ASRA run the sporting side etc , but for gods sake wait until after Newtons and arrange a physical meeting together
IF YOU DONT YOU WILL NOT RECEIVE SUPPORT FROM THE SPORT (means skaters like me) AND BOTH SIDES WILL SCREW UP WHAT WEVE ALL WORKED SO HARD FOR -
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Premium MemberPermalink Reply by Lance and Josh on -
the comments above a incorrect and misleading lets not mistake the format of GSE
it is a PRIVATE company NOT public and every company must have at least one shareholder (at least according to the companies office records in Queensland and SA....)
that been said its no ones business what turnover or profits it has either , it takes risks (meaning running events) and receives reward . if it breaks even or loses or profits its none of our business
GSE Ltd said:GSE is a public company, not a private company. GSE does not have shareholders. GSE is a 'not for profit' (read charity).
GSE contacted ASRA and are presently in discussions to move gravity sport forward.
[Bugs] To complain that ASRA is not open with information is getting things backwards - we'll always be more open than a private company. -
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ASRA AdminPermalink Reply by Bugs on -
Lance and Josh (15 yrs) said:...there needs (and should be) a host of commercial body(s) to organise events for reward . thats the way it works best simple and irrefutable .but for GSE to think it can run a national points and grading system......thats a bit of boundary jumping not needed and just shows inexperience on behalf of the directors ....
Lance, that's it exactly. It's great that GSE is putting on races - we support that. But for them to run national rankings and declare people National Champions - that directly conflicts with what we (ASRA) do, and it's a division in the sport. -
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Premium MemberPermalink Reply by Gabe on -
A nice big FUCK YOU to anyone who bad mouths ASRA or doubts their commitment and hard work. If it wasn't for this awesome group of people who put hours upon hours o time, money and effort into the Aussie downhill scene, we would be NOWHERE as a sport in Australia.
Thank you ASRA, for all your hard work behind the scenes for no personal gain except a warm fuzzy feeling inside, you guys ROCK! -
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Premium MemberPermalink Reply by Lance and Josh on -
I have to eat shit now...GSE is a PUBLIC company under legal definition , my company short search didnt reveal all the details...apologies
Lance and Josh (15 yrs) said:
the comments above a incorrect and misleading lets not mistake the format of GSE
it is a PRIVATE company NOT public and every company must have at least one shareholder (at least according to the companies office records in Queensland and SA....)
that been said its no ones business what turnover or profits it has either , it takes risks (meaning running events) and receives reward . if it breaks even or loses or profits its none of our business
GSE Ltd said:GSE is a public company, not a private company. GSE does not have shareholders. GSE is a 'not for profit' (read charity).
GSE contacted ASRA and are presently in discussions to move gravity sport forward.
[Bugs] To complain that ASRA is not open with information is getting things backwards - we'll always be more open than a private company. -
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Permalink Reply by Kam Kite on
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Yeah bro well said
Gabe said:A nice big FUCK YOU to anyone who bad mouths ASRA or doubts their commitment and hard work. If it wasn't for this awesome group of people who put hours upon hours o time, money and effort into the Aussie downhill scene, we would be NOWHERE as a sport in Australia.
Thank you ASRA, for all your hard work behind the scenes for no personal gain except a warm fuzzy feeling inside, you guys ROCK! -
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ASRA AdminPermalink Reply by bernie on -
"If we assume that ASRA's customers are its members"
Really struggled with leaping to that assumption
Because ASRA is it's members.
Then it took an entire 2 seconds of pondering before I realised that I was not really interested in poking myself in the eye!
Time to lock these discussions down until GSE and ASRA have had their meeting, and are able to release a joint statement.
besides they/we/us have a race to run. -
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Premium MemberPermalink Reply by sean meaney on -
very well said bernie.
This is something for the people behind both organisations to nut out and hopefully come to a solution that is in the best interests of the sport, lets wait for newtons to be run and see how things pan out
bernie said:"If we assume that ASRA's customers are its members"
Really struggled with leaping to that assumption
Because ASRA is it's members.
Then it took an entire 2 seconds of pondering before I realised that I was not really interested in poking myself in the eye!
Time to lock these discussions down until GSE and ASRA have had their meeting, and are able to release a joint statement.
besides they/we/us have a race to run. -
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Premium MemberPermalink Reply by haggy on -
ASRA and GSE have opened a dialogue and we are hopeful a resolution can be reached. This discussion is now being closed until such dialogue is concluded.
As you all also know ASRA has a World Cup race to attend to, which means we are already buried up to our necks without ongoing online distractions. As such, we'd appreciate if everyone just left this topic alone for the time being.
Haggy
ASRA President -
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